In a world where narratives often collide, Tucker Carlson’s exploration of what it means to be a Christian in the Holy Land has sparked considerable debate. While Carlson paints a specific picture of the Christian experience in Israel, self-described evangelicals, including prominent figures like Ted Cruz and Mike Johnson, appear detached from the underlying complexities of this reality—particularly the treatment of Christians in the region. This blog post delves into the nuances of Carlson’s claims, examining the perspectives of those who have lived, like Mother Agapia Stephanopoulos, who has dedicated years to understanding and advocating for the Christian community amidst the evolving cultural and political landscape of the Holy Land. Join us as we fact-check the assertions made, scrutinize the narratives shared, and ultimately seek to uncover a more comprehensive truth about the experiences of Christians in this historically rich and often contentious region.

Find a fact check of this transcript on CheckForFacts

Transcript:

[00:00:00,000]: Thank you for doing this

[00:00:01,759]: So you first moved to the Holy Land in 1996

[00:00:05,840]: Correct yep

[00:00:06,480]: As a nun

[00:00:08,140]: How are Christians doing in the Holy Land

[00:00:10,920]: Well it’s become a very difficult time for them there

[00:00:34,599]: Basically the Christians are in the same situation as the Muslims being a Palestinian

[00:00:40,119]: So the problem is so there’s two different things

[00:00:42,259]: If you live in Israel you’re a citizen and so they can live there and work but there’s sort of some petty grievances that people might have

[00:00:51,500]: But if you’re a Christian in Palestine which is where most of the activities of the Mount of Olives Jericho Jacob’s Well that’s all within Palestine

[00:01:05,180]: And so there’s many that’s the predominance of the Christian population there and they’re treated with the effects of the occupation which means you have checkpoints around you

[00:01:16,819]: A Christian who lives in Bethlehem cannot go to Jerusalem to the Holy Sepulchre without a permit by Israel and they don’t usually give those permits especially now

[00:01:26,699]: A Christian can’t

[00:01:27,699]: No without permission from Israel

[00:01:33,379]: That’s interesting because I mean those Christians that you’re describing I mean they are the descendants of the Christians who were converted by Jesus

[00:01:42,080]: They’ve been there from the beginning yeah

[00:01:43,660]: I mean right Christ came as a Jew right

[00:01:45,800]: Yes

[00:01:46,080]: Went to the temple but the people that converted and have lived there for centuries are in fact I think there’s been studies done on Palestinians living there now and they are the Canaanite descendants

[00:01:59,019]: They’re people that have been there for centuries or the greater part not just Palestine included Syria and Lebanon at a different time under different empires and things

[00:02:08,559]: So yeah they’re the first Christians the Christians at the time of Christ and it’s very difficult to practice their faith

[00:02:15,779]: It’s sort of like you’re in a gilded cage and that’s how I look at Bethlehem

[00:02:20,179]: Within Bethlehem you can live there but you can’t go and visit your friend who lives near Jacob’s well in Nablus without taking it

[00:02:28,240]: In fact the priest in Bethlehem just told me the other day his wife is from near Jenin which normally would take you about an hour and a half to get between the two

[00:02:37,520]: Her father has prostate cancer

[00:02:40,720]: In order to get treatment there was only hospitals nothing in the Northwest Bank could deal with it either in Jerusalem or in Hebron which is south of Bethlehem

[00:02:50,059]: And last year a couple years ago he was able to go to Jerusalem with a permit to get the treatment but this year the Israelis wouldn’t let him

[00:02:59,059]: So it took him over five hours to get down to Hebron and a man who’s old and sick to doing things

[00:03:04,300]: So whether it’s for those kind of activities or practicing your faith or visiting your relatives which is part of Christian life too right

[00:03:12,880]: You want to celebrate the holidays with your family and friends

[00:03:15,860]: It becomes very difficult to do

[00:03:18,820]: The reason I’m asking these questions well first I think it’s worth worrying about Christians who are the minority population

[00:03:26,539]: Well it’s worth worrying about Christians in general but the United States is a majority Christian country that pays for a huge percentage of the Israeli economy both through trade and direct grants and military assistance and all the rest

[00:03:39,119]: Israel couldn’t exist without the United States

[00:03:40,720]: So and it has the support of so many where I want to think they would care if they knew how the Christians are doing

[00:03:52,199]: And I keep reading that the Christian population in the region has declined dramatically since Israel became a state in 1948 and I’m not quite sure why

[00:04:03,080]: Well again I think it has to do because the whole issue is that Israel has continued to grow and think that they can dominate the Christian areas the areas of Palestine

[00:04:14,520]: So they make it very difficult for anyone else to be able to live there as simple as that

[00:04:19,559]: But you would think Christians would get a special pass or dispensation because the United States is the great patron and it’s a Christian country

[00:04:26,500]: No because well the problem you have is one with the Christian Zionists the ones who don’t recognize the Christians in the Holy Land as being fully Christian apparently because why would a crew I have a very hard time understanding why someone who calls himself a Christian and then gives money to support the building of settlements

[00:04:47,500]: Do we understand what that means

[00:04:49,279]: The settlements are in the areas of Palestine they’re taking over the land that belongs to the people of Palestine

[00:04:55,820]: And this has been going on like I said I’ve been there since 1996 and I’ve seen the continued growth of the settlement

[00:05:00,980]: I lived in Bethany biblical Bethany and over the mountain Mount of Olives was the convent I was in in Jerusalem

[00:05:09,160]: And to the east of me was the settlement of Mali Adumim in 1998

[00:05:14,459]: It was a relatively small settlement then

[00:05:16,500]: And then you go down the road to Jericho it was one lane it’s now a larger highway and that settlement of Mali Adumim is like a huge city and has closed off the people of Bethany

[00:05:28,839]: We are closed off in Bethany from going to our convent in Jerusalem because of the wall that was built on Palestinian land on Christian land

[00:05:38,179]: There’s a Christian home for boys that the Israelis just took over and cut up to make part of the wall that’s separate

[00:05:45,779]: So it wasn’t done for security to build that wall it was done simply to expand the borders of Israel

[00:05:53,540]: Wait so they went right through Christian land

[00:05:56,420]: Did Christians in the West say anything about this

[00:05:58,420]: Very few

[00:05:59,799]: I mean there was and also on that stretch at the lower end of the Mount of Olives there was a nursing home run by a Catholic church and the nun that was in charge she spoke to the French press and soon after she was sent to Lebanon or to another post wasn’t allowed to be there

[00:06:22,179]: Me at the same time we had the wall was built right beyond Lazarus tomb

[00:06:26,799]: Our school was walking distance from Lazarus tomb from where Martha and Mary lived and they built the wall right above where the tomb is

[00:06:34,500]: So that separated some of our teachers from being able to come to school

[00:06:37,920]: It separated our families on either side of the wall

[00:06:40,000]: So in April of 2005 I went to Washington and spoke to some Congress people not to demean Jews or not to even demean the state of Israel to say look we are being affected by this wall

[00:06:53,540]: It’s affecting our religious life

[00:06:55,320]: I can’t bring my I can’t go to visit my convent easily anymore because of this wall

[00:06:59,820]: It’s disrupting our school life and we’d like to see it’s not for security

[00:07:05,160]: It’s not separating Israel from Palestine

[00:07:09,619]: It’s separating Palestine from Palestine in the two

[00:07:12,739]: I get back home

[00:07:14,160]: I’m sorry what kind of reception did you so you went to Congress

[00:07:16,600]: Yeah and a handful

[00:07:18,179]: Actually I remember a very sweet occurrence

[00:07:20,399]: He’s died since but Senator Paul Wellstone of Minnesota I was scheduled to meet him and he wasn’t there but then he came and he literally ran down the hall to catch me

[00:07:31,359]: So there were a few there were a few people that were sympathetic but overall no

[00:07:37,140]: And I even felt a sense when I was talking to people that the like I went to a meeting where there were a few aides there of different Congress people right not just in one office and just felt as if there was someone there watching what was what he was saying or doing going on

[00:07:52,200]: So anyway so I get back

[00:07:53,579]: Did you meet with any Christian church leaders here in the U S

[00:07:57,299]: Unfortunately I mean the Catholic Church has done a lot and said a lot but I sad to say I feel the Orthodox Church in America has been very reluctant to speak out on this issue

[00:08:09,420]: Why

[00:08:09,679]: Or to get involved

[00:08:11,679]: Maybe sometimes we I think it’s a partly it’s just simply awareness

[00:08:15,859]: Even when people go on pilgrimages to the Holy Land they probably have Israeli tour guides and they don’t you know it’s an amazing experience to go to the Holy Land

[00:08:26,019]: It’s overwhelming to be a pious person to go there and you’re thinking about going to see where Jesus was and here I’m on the Sea of Galilee and you don’t really perceive what that wall means or who are those people living over there or how come there’s only cars with yellow plates here

[00:08:40,559]: And then we were in Jericho and I saw these green and white plates

[00:08:43,840]: What does that mean

[00:08:44,440]: Going on

[00:08:45,419]: They don’t understand it

[00:08:46,280]: So they don’t get the concept

[00:08:47,020]: What does the yellow license plate mean

[00:08:48,859]: Yellow plate is for people who live in the state of Israel and they can go on certain roads all roads

[00:08:57,119]: And for Palestinians who have a Jerusalem ID are allowed to have a car with the yellow plate

[00:09:03,080]: And then Palestinians have green and white plates and they cannot use

[00:09:07,460]: So over that time that I’ve been here as the settlements have grown you build the infrastructure for it

[00:09:12,059]: The electricity the roads separate roads that are used only by people that have yellow plates

[00:09:17,640]: As a foreigner and part of a foreign church we were entitled to have either those or they also have white diplomatic plates that kind of diplomatic and religious plates that are there

[00:09:27,820]: So there’s very much an apartheid system

[00:09:30,679]: Very much so

[00:09:32,359]: And but so which gave me the freedom to help my Christian friends in Bethlehem and one time there was a woman who her daughter they were from Bethlehem married a Christian who lived in Jerusalem

[00:09:46,780]: So he had rights to be in the city of Jerusalem have blue ID

[00:09:49,919]: But the mother when the daughter gave birth to their first child she didn’t have any way to go to see her daughter because it would be illegal for her to go into Jerusalem to get there

[00:10:00,820]: So I had the school van and I went to Bethlehem go get her

[00:10:06,380]: And a lot of times we’d have a little more leeway

[00:10:09,700]: You know if I get go through a checkpoint they’ll see it’s a nun and I go pass through a lot easier than someone else would

[00:10:16,280]: So I was able to get her through to be able to go see her daughter at the birth of her granddaughter

[00:10:20,440]: We’re sorry to say it but this is not a very safe country

[00:10:23,440]: Walk through Oakland or Philadelphia

[00:10:25,119]: Yeah good luck

[00:10:27,000]: So most people when they think about this want to carry a firearm

[00:10:30,440]: And a lot of us do

[00:10:32,140]: The problem is there can be massive consequences for that

[00:10:35,140]: Ask Kyle Rittenhouse

[00:10:36,260]: Kyle Rittenhouse got off in the end but he was innocent from the first moment

[00:10:39,039]: It was obvious on video and he was facing life in prison anyway

[00:10:43,780]: That’s what the anti gun movement will do

[00:10:46,039]: They’ll throw you in prison for defending yourself with a firearm

[00:10:48,659]: And that’s why a lot of Americans are turning to Burna

[00:10:51,859]: It’s a proudly American company

[00:10:53,979]: Burna makes self defense launchers that hundreds of law enforcement departments trust

[00:10:58,320]: They’ve sold over 600 000 pistols mostly to private citizens who refuse to be empty handed

[00:11:04,299]: These pistols and I have one fire rock hard kinetic rounds or tear gas rounds and pepper projectiles and they stop a threat from up to 60 feet away

[00:11:12,900]: There are no background checks

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[00:11:16,119]: Burna can ship it directly to your door

[00:11:18,739]: You can’t be arrested for defending yourself with a Burna pistol

[00:11:22,559]: Visit burnabyrna com or your local sportsman’s warehouse to get your Burna com

[00:11:30,359]: I’ll just be totally blunt with you

[00:11:32,739]: Most Americans are aware that there’s a system something like what you just described

[00:11:37,940]: But the pretext for it the justification for it is that there’s a lot of Islamic terrorism

[00:11:42,280]: There are a couple intifadas

[00:11:43,359]: There are a lot of suicide bombings

[00:11:45,039]: And it’s Islamic terror

[00:11:46,679]: And most Americans have been taught for 25 years that Islamic terror is a threat

[00:11:51,719]: And there’s some truth in that of course

[00:11:54,020]: But so we assume that Christians would be getting an exemption from all this

[00:12:02,299]: Why would Christians who are not responsible for Christian terror there’s no such thing why would they be penalized for this

[00:12:09,500]: Why wouldn’t they again when the patron saint state is majority Christian why wouldn’t the Christians there be getting some kind of special pass

[00:12:17,780]: I just don’t understand that

[00:12:19,440]: Why punish the Christians for Islamic terror

[00:12:22,700]: Because I don’t think it’s Islamic terror that’s taking place in the first place

[00:12:26,479]: I think we have to disabuse ourself of that notion that this is a battle between Muslim and Jew

[00:12:32,840]: Or that constantly you heard after the October event was that Hamas Hamas Hamas

[00:12:38,760]: Even to this day we hear it’s Hamas Hamas Hamas

[00:12:41,400]: What is Hamas

[00:12:43,979]: Hamas are people who have had their homes taken from them who if they live in Gaza have not been able have basically been in an open air prison for certainly the last 20 years going on

[00:12:56,840]: Even when the Israelis withdrew from Gaza they didn’t leave open borders

[00:13:02,299]: There was no freedom for people in Gaza to develop their economy

[00:13:05,900]: If I know people who wanted to try to go to school in America and couldn’t get out of Gaza had a Fulbright scholarship and weren’t able to leave

[00:13:13,539]: You mean couldn’t get out

[00:13:15,219]: Israel didn’t give permission

[00:13:16,419]: So what kind of freedom is that if you live in Gaza

[00:13:19,559]: They couldn’t even fly out

[00:13:20,539]: No

[00:13:20,940]: And their airport had been bombed in what 2000 and early on

[00:13:24,460]: There was an airport built soon after the Oslo Accords

[00:13:28,380]: But Israel has intervened many times in Gaza and little by little destroyed

[00:13:33,760]: You know when I first went there in 2002 after the second infighting started I remember saying to my mother back home you know this is genocide even that genocide by Chinese water torture

[00:13:44,679]: But now we’re seeing genocide on steroids

[00:13:48,460]: You’re American I should say

[00:13:49,580]: Yes I’m born in America

[00:13:51,000]: Yeah lived in America

[00:13:52,960]: And so getting back to Hamas

[00:13:55,179]: So also the school I was at has 350 girls

[00:13:59,520]: It’s in a town that’s 98 Muslim though it has roots

[00:14:05,080]: I mean it’s the roots of where Bethany where on our school grounds is a stone from the sixth century

[00:14:11,080]: This is where Christ met Martha at the resurrection

[00:14:15,260]: You know so we’re talking about and it’s the road leading there’s still part of the road the road that existed when Christ walked during that time and would have seen Lazarus and Martha and Mary

[00:14:25,760]: Lazarus’s tomb is down the road right

[00:14:27,799]: But it and so permeated even with Palestinian Muslim culture is the sense that Christians lived here and they recognized Jesus as a prophet

[00:14:36,859]: So they respect him as and so there’s I’m not saying that everything is perfect

[00:14:42,500]: You can’t have divisions between just like even with Christians

[00:14:45,919]: You know some Christians might think we should have allow politics to be in the church or legislate Christian morality and others would think totally different

[00:14:55,799]: So you can have sort of differences of opinion if you will and we can all live with each other between that

[00:15:00,140]: So with Muslim and Christian they can have their differences but overall the Palestinian culture is infused with both there

[00:15:09,460]: So you were a nun in a majority Muslim town a Christian nun in your habit I assume

[00:15:15,559]: Which also was to an advantage because pious Muslims are not jihadists the ones that I know

[00:15:21,239]: I’m not saying other parts of the world that may be the case but in Palestine it’s simply not the case or Syria or Lebanon or Iraq

[00:15:28,580]: The Muslims that for the most part are they’ve all grown up together the Christians and the Muslims

[00:15:35,500]: And there’s a certain amount of commonality and respect

[00:15:40,419]: And so me wearing being dressed like this was just like many of the women there right

[00:15:45,200]: So they kind of respected that

[00:15:46,539]: There’s the same sort of conservative culture

[00:15:48,859]: There’s the same sort of idea that we’re both have some same basic values of compassion for our neighbor of taking care of our families and trying to live

[00:16:00,580]: They have their form of fasting and almsgiving and it’s actually very important to them

[00:16:04,859]: And I think the best parts of Islam come from its development from Christian ideas that Muhammad came to know

[00:16:12,760]: I’m sure of that

[00:16:14,000]: You can sense it

[00:16:15,520]: This is a very different story from the one that we’re told in the American media that Christians are imperiled by Muslims in the Middle East

[00:16:21,700]: They are not imperiled by Muslims in Palestine

[00:16:26,239]: That is an absolute fact

[00:16:28,640]: And yeah that’s just not the case

[00:16:31,820]: And again going back to my school in our school we had icons which are part of the Orthodox tradition pictures of saints and crosses in every classroom

[00:16:40,739]: No problem with that

[00:16:41,859]: I could show you a photograph I can’t now but of the graduates of the latest high school graduation

[00:16:47,400]: And you know they’re embracing the nuns there

[00:16:49,500]: They’re dressed actually in a more secular way

[00:16:52,739]: And yeah it all works together

[00:16:55,080]: So a lot of your students were Muslim

[00:16:56,400]: Oh yeah 98

[00:16:58,080]: Of your students were Muslim

[00:16:59,840]: Yes yeah yeah yeah

[00:17:00,840]: And about half the teachers during the time I was there some Muslims some Christians

[00:17:05,660]: In a Christian school

[00:17:06,719]: Yes

[00:17:07,119]: And actually that’s all throughout Palestine

[00:17:09,219]: The Orthodox is relatively small

[00:17:11,680]: We do have schools in many of the Palestinian towns but also Catholic schools Lutheran schools and most of the population most of the students are Muslims

[00:17:20,920]: And the beautiful thing about where the great danger is if the Christians continue to diminish a key part of Palestinian society and within Israel as well you go to Nazareth you’ll see many Catholic run hospitals schools

[00:17:36,560]: And so it’s a fabric it’s a part of the whole character

[00:17:39,859]: But I’m just still confused by the idea that the Christian population is declining under Israeli rule

[00:17:47,160]: You would think just the opposite

[00:17:51,599]: What I observed from my time in Israel and going back every year is that they do not want any Palestinians there

[00:18:00,619]: So the majority of Christians in Israel and Palestine are Palestinian so they have to leave too

[00:18:08,719]: What grieves me is that the Holocaust is a horrible horrible thing that happened

[00:18:17,660]: People slaughtered fairly quickly

[00:18:22,599]: Sometimes the thought comes to me when I’ve driven between there’s a tunnel road that goes from Jerusalem to Bethlehem and it’s only for the settlers to go on down to the continued settlements that lead down further south in Israel to Hebron or actually I shouldn’t say Israel into Palestine other Palestinian territory

[00:18:39,939]: As you’re going that tunnel road has been carved out of land that belongs to people in Bethlehem and Bejala which you’re passing by on that tunnel road

[00:18:49,939]: So it’s like a living death

[00:18:51,520]: How would you like to be a man

[00:18:53,619]: That was your grandfather’s olive trees

[00:18:55,500]: But now it’s controlled by Israel and you’re not even allowed to drive on that road

[00:19:01,359]: And on that very same road I remember another poignant picture

[00:19:05,280]: There was a woman that worked at our convent a nurse and took care of the nuns

[00:19:10,219]: And she had a home a very typical stone Arab home beautiful home with grape vines

[00:19:17,280]: I remember going to pick the grapes at the house

[00:19:19,500]: That is now part of they just confiscated the land

[00:19:23,699]: She fought it

[00:19:24,780]: She fought as long as she could to try to keep her property

[00:19:27,920]: And I remember passing by there some years and there’s slowly slowly new Israel homes are being built that look very different

[00:19:36,199]: And there’s something that looks as if it belongs to biblical Palestine

[00:19:42,160]: And so what I was getting at is that these people they’re dying as they’re living

[00:19:48,660]: And I remember sitting at the home of one of those people in Bejala and they had lived in the center of town

[00:19:55,339]: It was his father’s home

[00:19:56,959]: And then he built a new one near the Talitha Kumi Lutheran School

[00:20:01,579]: And I literally was sitting with them one afternoon and he gets a call from his brother

[00:20:06,359]: The Israelis are here

[00:20:07,359]: They’re pulling up our olive trees cutting them down on some of their land

[00:20:12,060]: And he ran over

[00:20:13,959]: He got collected as many of the trees as he could

[00:20:17,459]: Military order

[00:20:18,040]: That’s what it was

[00:20:18,560]: They just go and do it even though it’s not their land

[00:20:21,560]: And then military order nothing you can do

[00:20:24,079]: They have Jeeps and weapons

[00:20:25,839]: You’re not going to stop them

[00:20:26,839]: But he was able to take some of those trees

[00:20:29,099]: This shows the resiliency and the word is samud

[00:20:32,479]: It’s like it’s a quiet persistence

[00:20:35,939]: This is our land and we’re going to stay here

[00:20:38,119]: And this man is a doctor who studied in Hungary

[00:20:40,260]: He took those olive trees and they now are in a plot of land next to his new house and trying to grow

[00:20:46,079]: So it’s like this is I’m not sure what Israel is trying to do

[00:20:51,219]: I mean it’s horrific what’s going on in Gaza

[00:20:53,400]: And what is very concerning to me and why I’m grateful to be on your show is that what is going to happen the people that I know in the West Bank Christian and Muslim it’s not said but it’s like we’re next

[00:21:10,099]: That what they’ve done to Gaza is going to come to us because who’s going to stop them

[00:21:16,459]: Already in the northern parts where the UNRWA the refugee camps were I was there in September

[00:21:23,380]: They had already been making raids

[00:21:26,500]: I was in the center of Jenin right in front of the Catholic Church

[00:21:29,520]: They had bulldozed the middle of the road and broken the water pipes

[00:21:33,959]: No bullet holes

[00:21:34,640]: I lived in 2002 during the Intifada in Bethlehem

[00:21:37,680]: The whole city was full of bullet holes

[00:21:39,459]: So there hadn’t been any confrontations but they were still bulldozing and doing what they wanted to do to wreck the infrastructure to make it harder for people to go to work up there

[00:21:47,239]: But now in the last eight months they’ve cleared out at least 15 000 people in Tul Karem and Jenin in the northern part

[00:21:57,939]: They’re not in their homes

[00:21:59,300]: Do you hear those stories

[00:22:01,839]: And these affect Christians as well

[00:22:03,739]: If it ain’t broke don’t fix it

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[00:22:15,079]: You’ve had it for years

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[00:23:20,046]: So why do American Christian churches send money to a government that does this to Christians

[00:23:25,826]: Well I think the ones that send money that support the settlements are obviously the Christian Zionists

[00:23:31,266]: There’s an organization called Christians United for Israel Pastor John Hagee

[00:23:37,306]: I was in Washington a few weeks ago because well they had a conference in Baltimore

[00:23:41,346]: So it’s slowly growing an awareness by other Christians in America that just like many Jews are protesting and saying not in our name and the Jewish voice for peace there has to be much more done by the Christians in America because these Christian Zionists are speaking in our name

[00:23:59,986]: Someone like Ted Cruz Senator Cruz is saying and doing what he’s doing because he’s following a Christianity that is not the Christianity of the Holy Land

[00:24:09,866]: It’s not the Christianity of a Catholic or an Orthodox or a traditional Christian

[00:24:14,326]: It’s a heretical belief

[00:24:17,706]: What is Christian Zionism

[00:24:19,566]: As far as I understand it they believe in the idea of the rapture

[00:24:23,466]: They believe that you know it’s sort of this cruel bargain they have going with Israel because basically what they say that they’re going to be swooped up into heaven right

[00:24:36,026]: And then there’s going to be a thousand year kingdom and then there’ll be the end of the world and the judgment by Christ and he’ll come back

[00:24:42,686]: This is a false it was condemned as a heresy in 381 because basically there is no thousand year millennium to come

[00:24:50,306]: No thousand year period

[00:24:52,486]: We are in that time period now and so it’s a false belief there

[00:25:00,446]: So basically what they’re arguing is that Jesus coming the first time wasn’t enough

[00:25:05,466]: Yeah and it’s like in a way it’s denying the Messiah

[00:25:10,466]: As an Orthodox Christian the most important thing in my life is that we receive the body and blood of Christ and we prepare ourselves to receive that body because Christ came as God and as man

[00:25:23,846]: And if you read John it’s actually 666 first he says Take eat this is my body and drink this is my blood

[00:25:31,746]: And many a people that heard the saying and found it to be a hard saying and turned away from him

[00:25:37,066]: So everybody was Jewish then right

[00:25:38,906]: But some believed and some didn’t

[00:25:41,546]: And some continued to follow only the law

[00:25:44,146]: And some said and Christ superseded the law

[00:25:47,326]: He said there’s something more than that law

[00:25:49,446]: I am the law

[00:25:50,326]: I fulfill the law and the prophets

[00:25:52,306]: We believe in the Feast of the Transfiguration on Mount Tabor

[00:25:54,886]: It takes place near Nazareth

[00:25:56,966]: I’ve been there many times

[00:25:58,586]: And in our icons in our images you see Moses and you see Elijah aside Jesus because the law and the prophets have been fulfilled in Jesus Christ

[00:26:08,846]: He came and said I’m the church I’m your salvation

[00:26:11,866]: And you know what I think often about is where I lived in the Mount of Olives St Mary Magdalene Convent right above it is a Catholic monastery called Dominus Flavid

[00:26:23,246]: Christ wept

[00:26:24,206]: It’s where Christ wept

[00:26:25,286]: And I think of it often now because to some degree with Muslims to a lesser degree because they retain some of the Christian sensibility but he’s weeping over the people that didn’t see him that didn’t understand who he was

[00:26:39,786]: Okay so they follow only the law

[00:26:41,866]: And I think that’s why you see these are people that can somehow justify allowing for the starvation and ethnic cleansing of so many people

[00:26:50,206]: Because think of the stories from the gospels where Christ heals the man with the withered hand

[00:26:57,026]: And he’s looking behind him are the Pharisees

[00:26:59,526]: And he’s grieved at their hardness of heart because he was healing doing a work on the Sabbath day

[00:27:05,766]: And that was against the law

[00:27:08,136]: And so now these Christians of wrong belief believe that they need to rebuild the temple as part of their plan

[00:27:18,446]: So they believe that the current state of Israel which has nothing to do with the biblical Israel is needed to be built up so that then somehow they can restore and build that temple fulfill an obligation of the law

[00:27:32,266]: And the price of that they’re willing to forego the compassion that Christ talked about and allow people to be starved and wiped out

[00:27:41,746]: And Christians in America have to understand that you’re allowing both people who support the state of Israel who are Jewish and those Christians who think they’re doing something in the name of Christ when it’s far from the name of Christ and it’s actually causing the end of the Christian population in the Holy Land

[00:28:01,386]: It’s going to be the numbers have dwindled

[00:28:04,746]: Now we’re getting to the small thousands

[00:28:06,426]: I just received a call the other day

[00:28:08,826]: Jacob’s Well is in the large city of Nablus in the center of the West Bank which has been grievously raids take place all the time and it’s very difficult

[00:28:19,006]: But what happened the other day was that a Christian run factory in Nablus there’s about 600 families around 600 Christians a number of churches and Jacob’s Well which is a very important site to us

[00:28:31,246]: We always go there on a pilgrimage when we can

[00:28:33,686]: And their factory no warning no permit

[00:28:38,226]: First on June 26th I believe the Israeli army came in and confiscated some of the factory equipment

[00:28:44,126]: And then two weeks later they came and blew up a big portion of the factory

[00:28:50,906]: So how are people supposed to have

[00:28:53,946]: They gave no reason

[00:28:55,306]: There was no permit

[00:28:56,066]: They have lawyers

[00:28:57,206]: There has been as far as I know to this date no court order no reason

[00:29:02,026]: And the only thing I mean quickly what popped into my head because it is a metal making factory okay they must be using it to make weapons right

[00:29:08,786]: These are Christians who have been there for decades centuries I think even the family

[00:29:13,266]: And it’s a well known business all right

[00:29:17,006]: And no order was given

[00:29:19,246]: And I almost feel a little worried about saying anything because I don’t know what the repercussions will be with that family because they have no recourse

[00:29:28,046]: Who do they go to

[00:29:29,166]: Where’s Ted Cruz in all this

[00:29:30,626]: Ted Cruz talks about how he’s a Christian

[00:29:32,446]: Mike Johnson is the Speaker of the House talks about how he’s a Christian

[00:29:34,646]: They talk about it a lot actually

[00:29:36,466]: I think they have to

[00:29:37,606]: We have to

[00:29:38,606]: I’m not sure that it can be done by

[00:29:41,686]: We have to battle AIPAC and the Christian Zionists by the Christians standing up saying not in my name

[00:29:47,306]: We can’t be doing this

[00:29:48,606]: So if they’re getting money from these organizations then Christians have to have enough concern to say I don’t want this happening in my name

[00:29:57,166]: No and to my brothers in Christ

[00:29:59,226]: Right exactly

[00:29:59,886]: And not only it’s the real people the living stones that are there that keep the churches open that keep things going but also for our Christian legacy

[00:30:08,506]: You know we’re supposedly a country based on a Judeo Christian heritage right

[00:30:13,686]: So where is that Judeo Christian heritage when you’re destroying the very foundations of it

[00:30:18,386]: St

[00:30:19,246]: Jerome translated the Bible in Bethlehem

[00:30:22,486]: The cells where he was at are under the Church of the Nativity

[00:30:26,366]: You know the very roots of our Christian heritage are there and we’re letting it be destroyed

[00:30:33,446]: Not physically and

[00:30:35,766]: Yeah physically by killing the people but also there’s a wonderful person

[00:30:39,966]: When you talk about resistance this all started with Hamas

[00:30:43,566]: So for the most part I would say they’re a resistance movement

[00:30:45,866]: They’re simply people fighting for their people trying to protect their land

[00:30:51,546]: And I don’t know if we want to reach into the area of

[00:30:54,326]: The whole problem is that it was never defined what Palestine is

[00:30:57,826]: You know the Oslo Accords took place and then there was nothing to

[00:31:02,226]: There was area A B and C

[00:31:04,626]: And you didn’t have a Palestine

[00:31:06,866]: So little by little Israel just keeps taking over the land confiscating building the settlements adding the checkpoints and strangling the life of anybody living there

[00:31:18,626]: Now I lost my train of thought

[00:31:20,546]: Well here’s a story you probably haven’t heard a lot about

[00:31:22,886]: The Chinese mafia is exploiting rural America to create a drug empire

[00:31:28,486]: This is not available on cable news

[00:31:31,526]: The network’s not telling you about this but it’s totally real

[00:31:33,946]: Communist affiliated drug gangs are destroying parts of the United States the parts that Washington ignores to sell drugs laundering money and building a black market network inside this country’s most beautiful but least served areas

[00:31:49,846]: We’ve got a brand new documentary on this

[00:31:51,946]: It’s called High Crimes The Chinese Mafia Takeover of Rural America

[00:31:55,866]: It’s available now on TuckerCarlson com

[00:31:58,586]: It’s excellent

[00:32:00,066]: The purchase of churches and schools to aid the operation the jerry rigging of power boxes to steal electricity foreign pesticides collusion with the Mexican cartels

[00:32:09,666]: It’s unbelievable

[00:32:11,026]: By the way one of the drug houses is like walking distance from my house

[00:32:13,986]: I didn’t know that

[00:32:15,226]: It’s a layered and fascinating story

[00:32:17,666]: Head to TuckerCarlson com to watch now

[00:32:20,206]: We think you’ll love it

[00:32:24,606]: The state of Israel you know is less than 80 years old but that area is thousands of years old controlled by various empires as you’ve said and then finally the British until 1948

[00:32:37,526]: During all that time huge pieces of land were owned by various Christian churches particularly in Jerusalem

[00:32:45,666]: What happened to that

[00:32:46,806]: Do they still own that land

[00:32:48,046]: They own the land but this is where it’s sort of a lesser kind of persecution is that they use legal means or semi legal means because you have land that was under the Ottoman Empire and there might be some documents or certain leases and they say well the lease is up now we have to renegotiate it and suddenly the Christians have lost a portion of their land

[00:33:09,706]: Or they’ll use middlemen and say and it’s sort of acts of deceit and they end up buying large these front companies come and buy off some of the land and you don’t realize that it’s going to not Christians or not to Palestinians and being used in another way

[00:33:27,306]: In Jerusalem that happens

[00:33:28,586]: All yeah primarily around Jerusalem Jerusalem and Bethlehem there’s large chunks that have been taken

[00:33:34,966]: The Knesset sits on the land owned by the Jerusalem Patriarchate

[00:33:40,186]: What

[00:33:41,106]: Yeah

[00:33:41,486]: Well it was their land yeah

[00:33:43,686]: And they have a lease

[00:33:44,806]: They have a lease for it

[00:33:46,086]: How did they get it

[00:33:47,746]: Well obviously they allowed them to have that

[00:33:49,586]: That was a legal operation that was done yeah to have that land

[00:33:54,506]: When you first got there 30 years ago were there more Christians than there are now

[00:33:59,646]: There were more

[00:34:00,366]: I mean it still has been a relatively small population in the tens of thousands I think in Palestine overall

[00:34:08,346]: But it’s certainly I think the greater degree and little by little it’s decreased but it’s really getting frightening now because I think these last two years it’s sort of like almost pushed people over the edge

[00:34:21,906]: But then you hear of families in communities like five or 10 families that are leaving now going to Europe sometimes the US or Canada or Australia

[00:34:31,346]: And that’s not only Christians of course

[00:34:33,486]: Muslims are a bigger population because there are people if you’re raising your child and there’s no job opportunities for them and quite frankly there’s a good likelihood that if you’re a teenage boy that you could get shot

[00:34:46,906]: I mean I know a number of kids in Al Azharia where I was 14 15 year olds who have been shot

[00:34:53,246]: And look at the difference in that

[00:34:56,306]: Supposedly throwing a Molotov cocktail

[00:34:58,546]: And now think about when the war started with Ukraine and Russia

[00:35:02,526]: I remember a story in the New York Times

[00:35:05,146]: It was a huge story celebrating that a beer factory was now generating Molotov cocktails to throw against the Russians

[00:35:12,226]: And that was celebrated

[00:35:14,406]: In Palestine hundreds of teenage boys have been killed because Israel will say they were throwing a Molotov cocktail

[00:35:25,286]: And I know of one case he wasn’t even I think he was 12 years old last year

[00:35:29,226]: I know a beautiful man a Dr Salim who’s Muslim but who used to take care of the nuns at our convent

[00:35:34,926]: He lives in Shofat refugee camp which is part of Jerusalem

[00:35:39,226]: They pay Jerusalem taxes but a wall surrounds them

[00:35:43,686]: They’re guarded by Israeli soldiers

[00:35:46,286]: He tries to run a disability center but they’re constantly being raided people being detained by the Israelis

[00:35:54,386]: And the infrastructure there you can tell when you’re in Palestine East Jerusalem versus the West

[00:36:01,146]: One has nice sidewalks good schools

[00:36:03,586]: The other is decrepit

[00:36:05,666]: Anyway Dr Salim there was a boy at the camp there 12 years old

[00:36:10,646]: It was a Muslim holiday and he was shot dead

[00:36:14,946]: And what they said was he had thrown a Molotov cocktail

[00:36:17,546]: And he was 200 yards from any soldier and they shot him dead

[00:36:21,446]: But that literally happens every day

[00:36:24,466]: I have a young man that we just helped come to America a year and a half ago who lives north of Hebron a Christian and his family he went to school a half hour north in Shepherd’s Field

[00:36:34,846]: We wanted to bring him to America because he was at that age where you look the wrong way at a soldier and it’s a possibility of getting shot

[00:36:42,586]: He’s Christian but he could be Muslim

[00:36:44,206]: The point is that this is what happens to them

[00:36:46,286]: So any normal family they want to stay in their land

[00:36:50,986]: It’s difficult to immigrate

[00:36:52,886]: How are you going to be treated going to another country and have to pick up your livelihood and leave other family members

[00:36:58,466]: It’s not an easy thing to do but yeah it is happening that the population is declining

[00:37:03,306]: And the priests are very concerned

[00:37:04,906]: I’ve talked to a number of priests in the West Bank and they are aware of the situation

[00:37:10,386]: So what we’re hoping to do there’s sort of a latent movement of Christians that don’t have this Christian Zionist perspective

[00:37:18,246]: And the Catholic Church has always done some to support the communities over there but we haven’t done anything politically because ultimately it’s not the money that’s needed now

[00:37:26,906]: It has to be the change that

[00:37:29,666]: We have to change the support of Israel

[00:37:32,306]: If you allow the settlements to continue

[00:37:35,146]: James Carville right

[00:37:36,526]: He was under Clinton and he came up with a phrase for the campaign it’s the economy stupid

[00:37:42,226]: The problem with Israel and Palestine is not Muslim versus Jew

[00:37:46,286]: It’s the occupation stupid

[00:37:48,566]: That’s really what it comes down to

[00:37:50,486]: And unless we get something where a sovereign Palestinian state where they’re granted their freedom is created and maybe that’ll be two states with a boundary or maybe it’ll be some sort of confederation

[00:38:01,806]: That’s up to the politicians to decide

[00:38:03,946]: But unless there’s freedom and an ability for the Palestinians to develop and be free to have their country Christians will continue to leave

[00:38:13,066]: And what will happen not only those living stones will leave but the holy sites

[00:38:20,586]: What gives me the greatest pleasure is after I left Jerusalem I’ve lived in America but two times a year I bring pilgrims people who want to come and visit the holy sites

[00:38:32,566]: Go and see where Jesus Christ was crucified and resurrected

[00:38:36,146]: Go see where he was born

[00:38:37,326]: Go up to the Sea of Galilee

[00:38:39,006]: Be a part of that

[00:38:39,726]: And one of our saints says taking a pilgrimage to the Holy Land is like the fifth gospel

[00:38:46,186]: So we can read the Bible all we want but it’s when we go there and really are at the places where our Lord walked and lived and performed his miracles that it deepens your Christianity

[00:38:58,766]: In fact one of the loveliest things is I take people of all ages and I’ll ask them younger people at the end of the trip so what do you like the most

[00:39:06,606]: And some people might say the Dead Sea or something but I’ve also been struck that 15 year old boys will come back and tell me it’s when we went to the Holy Sepulcher and to the tomb of Christ

[00:39:16,286]: So there’s obviously something there that’s important to our Christian heritage

[00:39:20,446]: And what’s happening is if the Christians are forced to leave if Israel takes greater control what we will have is museums

[00:39:30,146]: They won’t be living places of prayer

[00:39:32,106]: And that will be a great tragedy not only for the Christians but I think for the whole world

[00:39:37,466]: Yeah because they’re not owned by government

[00:39:39,806]: I mean these are pre existing

[00:39:41,886]: Of course they’ve been there for centuries

[00:39:42,806]: And they have gone down and up

[00:39:45,186]: I mean there have been times over the centuries where Christians have had difficult times and then rose up again and did

[00:39:52,866]: So I think actually we’re in one of those dark times

[00:39:55,786]: I mean we could go into a whole explanation of why the world it is

[00:39:58,686]: Why do we even allow

[00:40:00,386]: This is mind boggling to me

[00:40:02,426]: It’s getting painful

[00:40:03,426]: I can’t look at anything right now

[00:40:05,266]: And I think a lot of people every day these stories of what is happening and people justifying it

[00:40:12,286]: To anyone with a conscience it’s sort of like what are we doing

[00:40:15,786]: And how has this evil been allowed to grow and develop

[00:40:21,266]: Did you make any converts in Palestine ever

[00:40:24,846]: Did you have Muslims converting to Christianity

[00:40:27,146]: You have to be careful with it

[00:40:29,066]: But I will say that I don’t know those Muslims that have converted to Christianity but it’s not something you can do openly

[00:40:35,166]: Not that they’re going to be killed but it won’t be looked upon well

[00:40:39,306]: And it’s not easy to do

[00:40:40,726]: Is it legal

[00:40:43,346]: To proselytize

[00:40:44,946]: Yeah

[00:40:45,806]: We’re in Palestine

[00:40:47,326]: Yeah

[00:40:48,866]: You can talk to me

[00:40:49,746]: I guess it doesn’t you know the interesting thing is I’m Orthodox

[00:40:52,466]: And in Orthodoxy we don’t aren’t really a proselytizing faith

[00:40:57,166]: It’s a faith that’s becomes of what you are and how you live

[00:41:00,866]: You know what I mean

[00:41:01,326]: It says that you don’t actively do missionary work in a lot of cases

[00:41:06,766]: Mostly it’s just by your example

[00:41:08,746]: And that was the first Christians right

[00:41:10,206]: And who were martyrs

[00:41:11,946]: Or were people or their way of life because they weren’t pagans because they were trying to treat people decently and people responded to that

[00:41:20,766]: You were following the message of Christ and that people said oh yeah well we really don’t want to live like the sybaritic life that we were living before

[00:41:27,526]: And that looked appealing to people

[00:41:29,066]: So that is what the witness of Christianity is

[00:41:31,966]: And that’s another reason why if it’s gone it’ll only hasten the bloodshed and the destruction in the Middle East

[00:41:37,826]: Because I think that Christians are a buffer between Muslim and Jew in Palestine

[00:41:44,386]: Yes that makes sense

[00:41:46,066]: Were you there

[00:41:46,906]: There was a siege at the Church of the Nativity in Bethlehem birthplace of Jesus

[00:41:52,986]: Maybe 2002

[00:41:54,726]: Oh yes I was there

[00:41:57,466]: That’s where I became especially close to the Palestinian Christian community

[00:42:01,766]: Because in Bethany there aren’t that many Christians but we had teachers from there and students from there the boarding students

[00:42:08,406]: And when the siege happened it wasn’t just a siege on the church itself

[00:42:12,226]: What they claimed was that there were some fighters that were in the church which actually that’s a Christian tradition for people to take refuge in a church

[00:42:20,766]: But the Israelis used that as a way to well they besieged the church

[00:42:24,886]: But the whole town was under siege not just the church

[00:42:29,226]: So that meant that the teachers who lived in the Bethlehem area couldn’t get out of Bethlehem to come over to Bethany

[00:42:35,826]: People couldn’t get food and medicines

[00:42:37,206]: After a while it became I would get calls and saying you know my neighbor has epilepsy and we cannot get a new medication for her

[00:42:44,686]: Can you find a way to get something in you know through a care organization into us

[00:42:49,106]: And finally when the siege end during that time I remember a doctor telling me how describing how someone had been shot in his house and he was bleeding to death

[00:43:02,026]: And he was calling the doctor you know what do I do

[00:43:03,966]: What can I do

[00:43:04,686]: And the doctor literally heard him bleed to death during that because no ambulance nothing was allowed

[00:43:10,466]: And after the 40 days roughly 40 days which is ironic I went in there and I met up with some of the people

[00:43:20,046]: Everything was strewn with garbage all over the streets

[00:43:22,706]: The bullet holes you know what Israel likes to do is destroy

[00:43:26,726]: Not only do they control the place but they almost take glee

[00:43:30,006]: And we’re not talking about Hamas time

[00:43:32,346]: We’re not talking about you know 2023

[00:43:35,246]: We’re talking about 2002

[00:43:37,406]: They would go through the town of Bethlehem and purposely with their tanks APs the smaller ones like knock over the light poles or the things that are garnished with Christmas trees you know decorations and things and knock them over in the middle of town or pull their bulldozer and smash a car

[00:43:53,326]: But again that same resiliency of the Palestinians the Samud I have a photograph

[00:43:58,726]: He’s actually the father of one of the priests now in Bethlehem and he’s sitting on his car that had been smashed by the Israelis just with a smile kind of like you’re not going to stop us

[00:44:08,446]: We’re going to carry on

[00:44:09,546]: You know you did this to me but I’m going to carry on

[00:44:12,826]: There were people shot inside the church

[00:44:15,106]: Yeah the bell ringer there was shot dead

[00:44:17,286]: Was he a Christian

[00:44:18,646]: Of course

[00:44:19,126]: Yeah yeah

[00:44:20,606]: So that was the moment And Christians were shot outside the church

[00:44:23,906]: I don’t know if it was exactly during those 40 days but a young 16 year old boy who had an altar boy of the church you know there were curfews going on and they had tanks all around the city circling them

[00:44:35,786]: And he was out with his 70 year old cousin I think it was and they were just kicking a soccer ball

[00:44:41,706]: He was shot dead by a sniper 16 year old Johnny Talgia

[00:44:47,106]: You remember his name

[00:44:48,166]: Of course

[00:44:48,986]: And also there was another Christine Saada

[00:44:50,826]: Her father was the principal of the Orthodox school in Bet Zohor Shepherd’s Field

[00:44:55,406]: They were driving and the Israeli soldiers who That is area A right

[00:45:02,186]: If you want to talk about the politics of it

[00:45:04,226]: Technically that means it was under full Palestinian control

[00:45:07,126]: They should have their police and everything

[00:45:08,806]: No Israeli jeeps were there and they mistakenly thought that was a car of some militant

[00:45:13,466]: So they shot up the car

[00:45:15,086]: His wife was injured

[00:45:16,286]: He was injured as well and his 12 year old daughter Christine was killed

[00:45:21,046]: Why

[00:45:21,546]: What did they do wrong

[00:45:23,866]: They thought the Israelis thought that was somebody that was going to do something bad

[00:45:29,726]: Was anyone ever punished for it

[00:45:31,226]: Of course not

[00:45:32,486]: Of course not

[00:45:32,906]: I had an incident in front of our school where they had put us on curfew and our girls the bedroom of the border girls were on the main street

[00:45:41,506]: And I look out it was curfew time but I saw and there were soldiers sort of marching up and down the street a handful of them not like a brigade and there was a man walking up to the soldier

[00:45:52,766]: I thought oh my goodness it’s a Palestinian man

[00:45:55,206]: It turned out he was deaf mute and he wasn’t from Bethany

[00:45:58,326]: He was from Hebron but he had relatives there

[00:46:00,326]: He didn’t understand what was going on because they called curfew any time and then you got to get off the street

[00:46:06,146]: So the soldier shot him in the eye

[00:46:07,546]: The man’s a deaf mute and he ended up getting shot in the eye

[00:46:10,486]: He survived but he was shot in the eye right outside our door

[00:46:13,026]: And for all for a couple of years we had a tank in front of the school

[00:46:18,326]: And often I had to Why was were the girls dangerous at the school

[00:46:21,906]: Well the Palestinians are dangerous

[00:46:25,266]: All Palestinians yeah five year old girls are dangerous

[00:46:28,386]: But what was danger to us is Mount of Olives

[00:46:32,886]: This was before the or while the process of the wall being built there had been a situation where some settlers probably the followers of Ben Gavir they had taken a little truck and they had explosives and they had gone in front of a high school on the top of the Mount of Olives

[00:46:50,246]: Fortunately it was stopped before they blew it up

[00:46:52,826]: So every day I remember for at least six months because they’d also done something similar near us near the Mali Adumim settlement I would actually go

[00:47:01,666]: We had a fairly large property and there’s like gates on either side where the girls would come in

[00:47:06,146]: Every morning I’d be up at six in the morning and go make sure that there I didn’t see like a little bomb someplace because that was what was going on

[00:47:14,926]: And I totally wouldn’t do it

[00:47:16,126]: you worried the settlers would bomb the school

[00:47:18,406]: They attempted to

[00:47:19,746]: They attempted to

[00:47:20,506]: Why

[00:47:20,626]: There were complications

[00:47:22,286]: Palestinians

[00:47:23,726]: But kids

[00:47:25,066]: Doesn’t matter

[00:47:26,563]: doesn’t matter at all

[00:47:28,803]: I remember thinking in 2002 when the bell ringer was shot in the church on the site where Jesus was born so it’s kind of the center of Christianity that in the Church of the Holy Sepulcher where he was buried

[00:47:44,223]: I remember thinking like are American Christians in the United States whose weapons literally they were using AR 15 platforms for this American rifles American ammunition American uniforms American bulldozers

[00:47:57,123]: Are they really gonna put up with this

[00:47:59,603]: Was there any pushback from the United States

[00:48:01,923]: The problem is the lack of awareness

[00:48:05,623]: I worked at CNN at the time and I interviewed Benjamin Netanyahu about this at the time

[00:48:10,963]: I’ll never forget it

[00:48:11,883]: And what was his response

[00:48:14,043]: Terrorists

[00:48:14,763]: We do what we have to do

[00:48:16,003]: No apologies

[00:48:16,843]: But I said but that’s our church

[00:48:19,123]: And it’s also propaganda

[00:48:20,303]: And the Christians have nothing to do with this so what are you doing

[00:48:21,983]: And it was like shut up anti Semite

[00:48:24,443]: But I remember thinking maybe I mean I’m just some like semi agnostic news douche from CNN but like where are the ministers on this

[00:48:35,663]: I think a lot of times they didn’t want to get involved

[00:48:39,943]: It’s the same fear that the mainstream media seems to have is that we don’t want to rock the boat

[00:48:46,623]: And it’s and also to be fair because the mainstream media doesn’t do its job fully people are given a very distorted picture of events so they don’t know what’s happened or going on

[00:48:56,763]: This is a kind of a minor example but at that time period my brother was coming up for a job at ABC News and there was a story on the page six New York Post

[00:49:07,963]: George’s crazy my name at that time was Maria George’s crazy sister Maria

[00:49:13,223]: And what they said it was like the Drudge Report is where it came from that kind of thing that I had said that Israeli soldiers were raping women in in Bethlehem

[00:49:24,423]: Point of fact someone had contacted me about that in an email from America and said did you hear anything about any anything going on like that

[00:49:32,543]: I said no you know we have a lot of difficulties

[00:49:35,083]: I do know where they’ve gone into doctors clinics and they’ve like broken the the sonogram machine and they they put graffiti on it went to the bathroom on there

[00:49:46,323]: The same kind of things that they’re doing in Gaza they were doing it in the early 2000s

[00:49:50,283]: Raiding people’s homes for to may have a vantage point and then steal the things in there and herd the family into one room

[00:49:57,043]: And so I said but you know I said well let me check it out I haven’t heard any stories like that and I contacted friends in Bethlehem

[00:50:02,203]: No no the Christian said no nothing like that has happened and I wrote back to that person and said that but it didn’t matter they put it that that’s what comes out on the news is what they want to come out in the news

[00:50:12,343]: So this was someone trying to keep your brother from getting a job at ABC News

[00:50:15,743]: Either to keep it or to keep him in line right

[00:50:19,103]: You don’t want to step out and say anything against Israel

[00:50:22,863]: Did you talk to your brother about it

[00:50:25,463]: It’s a difficult conversation and I think it’s probably better for him to say why or he does I think I think it’s the it’s not it’s not his problem I think it’s a problem in all of mainstream media and it’s certainly a great problem right now

[00:50:37,623]: I mean you know and even with this we’re dealing now it’s becoming a lot of publicity on the star even though it is being distorted

[00:50:45,223]: I actually watched the news this morning and James Stavridis is on and he’s talking about it’s all Hamas and they show the emaciated hostage and as if you know we would everything would be okay if only Hamas would release the hostage and and and that’s the starvation

[00:50:59,903]: When it’s taking place millions of people are being starved

[00:51:04,963]: Babies are dying there and we’re focused God I hope the hostage gets freed

[00:51:09,203]: He should get freed and he should get freed and Israel should remove themselves from Gaza and allow the the food to get in and that’s and Christians should be pushing for that and I think we are seeing that to some degree now but it’s still obscuring the main point

[00:51:22,483]: Like I said the great the unspoken thing when I talk to all my friends on the West Bank now is that is that they know we’re next that it’s gonna happen and it will happen maybe we’ll go back to that time where it’ll be more like they play a long game you know even with this settlement building we’ll build and then if America gives a little bit of pushback okay we stop for a while and then we start again

[00:51:44,623]: So maybe even in the West Bank for now if there’s hopefully will be some resolution with a ceasefire and and bringing food into Gaza that in the West Bank that they’ll step back for a little while but that doesn’t mean that in another few months there’ll be some provocation

[00:52:03,163]: Like I said they’ve already wiped out thousands of people from refugee camps in Tel Karem and Jenin

[00:52:07,663]: They’re making life very difficult in many towns in Taiba in Bethlehem water is is not given to the city so you don’t have water unless you have your water tanks and there’s no rain you know when I first moved to Jerusalem and you do your laundry you hang it outside and I came there in May there don’t rain until October if you’re lucky so those water tanks aren’t getting filled during the summertime and Israel controls the access to the water to the Palestinian towns so if they decide they only get it once a week you only get it once a week while they have swimming pools in their settlements and green plush grass that Christian Zionists are paying for

[00:52:43,943]: Have you you know a lot of Christians in the Holy Land how many support the government of Israel do you know

[00:52:52,823]: The Palestinians within Israel

[00:52:58,423]: Yeah I don’t know that they would be any that really would

[00:53:03,523]: What’s the what’s the especially now

[00:53:05,523]: I mean they’re literally throwing out Palestinian representatives

[00:53:09,643]: So in the US there’s a sense that Christians support this program

[00:53:13,263]: Of course not and and to the you know when I first moved there in 98 there was hope for peace and there was a much stronger peace movement within Israel people who recognized not just a cold peace but that we can live together and we should work towards that but that’s certainly been abolished

[00:53:30,443]: It’s just so strange

[00:53:31,123]: I lived in DC for all this but like at the you know the final decade of the Cold War there were a lot of Jews in the Soviet Union who were being persecuted

[00:53:41,563]: Well everyone in the Soviet Union is being persecuted including the Jews

[00:53:44,283]: And they came to Israel

[00:53:46,243]: Yeah they came to Israel they came to the United States and there were Jewish groups in the US and in Israel that I supported then and I support now who said we got to get our people out of there and help them

[00:53:55,903]: They’re called Refuseniks

[00:53:57,123]: Right

[00:53:57,583]: And my dad worked in this actually and I thought that was great

[00:54:01,163]: Sure

[00:54:01,463]: You don’t see that with any Christian group with Christians in the Middle East

[00:54:04,423]: There’s no Christian group in the United States that I’m aware of

[00:54:06,703]: It’s like hey those are our people maybe we should help them

[00:54:08,703]: They are

[00:54:09,283]: In fact there was just a conference down in Atlanta there’s something called Churches for Middle East Peace and there’s a group like Telos group there’s Christians for a Free Palestine but they’re very small and they’re not so much part of the Institute you know the hierarchy of the church

[00:54:23,103]: But we had Pope Francis did speak out and I think certainly the Catholic Church in America has to let do a lot more as an institution

[00:54:32,203]: I mean we should have a Christian AIPAC group

[00:54:36,223]: 100

[00:54:36,523]: Yeah going on

[00:54:38,203]: Like you’re not allowed to shoot up the Church of the Nativity sorry I mean even if you’re agnostic on the politics sector or whatever which is fine maybe preferable but you can’t do that to Christians

[00:54:48,803]: How about no

[00:54:50,443]: I agree 100 so we have to move to that

[00:54:54,083]: But again to be that gets back to the thing though is that people don’t always see the whole story and we’re just flooded with this message that those terrorists are coming to get us next which is absurd

[00:55:07,303]: Has any member of Hamas or anybody of a Palestinian come and threatened America as an American

[00:55:13,343]: No

[00:55:14,043]: That’s not what they’re about

[00:55:17,003]: The thing is that but that’s the tactic that’s used is that we have to plaster them as being these jihadist when they’re nothing like that

[00:55:24,603]: Are they I mean I’m sure you’ve dealt with Hamas or know people who are right are they religious fanatics are these jihadis

[00:55:34,363]: Not the people that I know like I said when I when I was again in at the school we had a couple teachers Muslim men and there were some elections going on and it wasn’t Hamas then it was the Social Party or somebody who’s definitely a religion Muslim religious party

[00:55:50,363]: I would have voted for those guys because they weren’t corrupt they wanted to serve their people and that’s what it was about

[00:55:57,443]: So I’m not saying it doesn’t happen anywhere I’m not totally ingrained in the community but I don’t it doesn’t the vibe there isn’t one of wanting everybody to convert to Islam and forcing it upon them at all at all and the purpose of Hamas is primarily to resist and to protect their people and their land

[00:56:21,103]: It’s not just Palestine and Israel where the Christian population is shrunk it seems like throughout the Levant

[00:56:27,103]: Yes we just and I think that’s part of the whole greater Israel project you know isn’t it so ironic that they’ve made such a big thing

[00:56:34,443]: Targeting Christians

[00:56:35,823]: Targeting Christians yeah well to make control for Israel for example in Syria

[00:56:42,983]: I went to Syria in 2004 and I went to the place the convent of St

[00:56:47,163]: Thekla where outside of Damascus in Malula where the nuns were kidnapped by ISIS right and the population is over 10 Christian and you have ancient Christian sites as well as vibrant monastic communities there and vibrant churches and hospitals that were run by the church but in Syria and Lebanon right and now what have we done and so Assad wasn’t perfect Saddam Hussein wasn’t perfect but the Middle East is not the United States and we tried to impose ourselves there and get rid of these governments who for all the repression also kept the people to get allowed minorities to survive there

[00:57:27,823]: Including Christians

[00:57:28,463]: Including Christians yeah and Christians yeah and this and just recently and so I find it mind boggling that now we take sanctions off after Assad is gone and we put in place someone who was Daesh who was part of ISIS

[00:57:42,503]: Does a leopard change its spots

[00:57:44,883]: And how are the Christians in Syria doing that

[00:57:46,403]: Well we had the bombing we had the actually very if you may I’d like to look for the statement yeah from Patriarch John of Antioch whose brother was a bishop and was kidnapped in 2010 and presumed to be bombing a suicide bombing in the church in in Damascus Mar Elias and Patriarch John he didn’t pull any punches he came and he said to the he gave a eulogy but he also called out the government because they didn’t really condemn the act at all the ISIS government and and he says Apostle Paul in his epistles to the Romans for whether we live we live to the Lord and whether we die we die to the Lord the rock of our faith is the Lord who rose from the dead and the martyrs who live who lie before us today our children of the resurrection they dwell in the divine light they did not die they are alive they have passed on even if in this horrific way to the one whom they loved he’s living like we’re supposed to live as Christians is talking at it the Christians there but then he says but I will say boldly mr

[00:58:54,023]: president Abu Jalani Ashara the former head of HDS head of Asia the ISIS group we deeply regret mr

[00:59:02,783]: president that in the immediate aftermath of the crime not a single government or state official was present at the scene except for mrs

[00:59:09,863]: Hind Kabbalah a Christian we regret that deeply we are an integral component of this nation and we are here to stay that we remind you the two archbishops of Aleppo Boulos and Johanna were kidnapped and much was said at the time the Malala nuns were also kidnapped and here we still are this heinous crime was committed the day before yesterday and we will remain here we appeal to you mr

[00:59:34,603]: president for a government that does not get distracted by issuing unnecessary decisions unworthy of mention from the sacred royal door we call for a government that takes responsibility and shares in the suffering of its people mr

[00:59:47,723]: president the people are hungry if some have not told you I am telling you honorable come and take care of your people I think that’s pretty bold for a guy who had his brother kidnapped just had a number of practitioners bombed and he’s telling someone who has been known to be a terrorist calling him out that’s pretty bold it’s pretty but I would say that’s pretty bold so the government of Syria now the government run by the former ISIS leader is pro israel yeah I mean I think that’s the whole plan and you know when you get to it they talked about the from the river to the sea right where did that statement come from look at the Charter of Likud the party of Netanyahu they verily clear very clearly say from the Jordan to the Mediterranean is going to be Israel and if I really from the Nile to the Euphrates which means going into Iraq into the edges of Egypt and up to so on so that’s why we had the war in Iraq why did our young people have to die why did we have to spend so much money on a war I was supposed to visit Iraq in early 2000s our school secretary her father was born in Mosul and he was in a Syrian Christian and so we this is an opportunity to go and visit him and that’s when they started chopping off the heads and doing things so we thought better of making that part of the trip but how many how many Christians were displaced from Iraq during that time almost all of them and now in Syria you’re seeing the same thing which in 2004 I saw vibrant communities I saw people who could live even under Assad as Christians now they’re in fear for what’s going to happen to them I mean it’s hard to see this as an accident so West Bank Gaza Iraq some sort of plan Syria Lebanon all places where US foreign policy chutzars at the behest of Israel see the destruction of Christian communities I’m guessing that’s like not an accident no not at all it’s definitely part of a plan but the thing is why should we be supporting that plan and also you know we’re focusing on the Christians but I said I had we had two girls who are Russian background who lived in the cities of Israel and what you’ve seen the last 20 years too as instead of that nascent peace movement instead of people who tolerated their neighbor and could live with their neighbor we it’s become a totally militant society the girls I know that are there now it’s a lot of aggression and a lot of hatred and how many Israelis have that though you having big problems in Greece now I don’t know if you’ve seen the demo I’m a Greek right yeah people are parading through the straits because Israelis have left Israel even though they’re the ones that have all the defense right all the action even what kind of a country is Netanyahu trying to have do you really want to leave and live in a militarized country that’s to always in in fear and always thinking that they should they’re under attack when they don’t have to be you say it’s more hostile you see these videos of Christians priests with crucifixes around their necks getting spit on Jerusalem are those real yes and I mean that’s happened before you know even from the first days that I was occasionally something like that and occasionally there were graffiti put on walls and sprayed on Jesus a monkey 2013 yeah that’s right in Topka the where the multiplication of the the loaves and the fish a Catholic community graffiti they’re talking about getting rid of the idols or something like that some sort of Old Testament statement and do and burning burning a statue of the Virgin Mary in parts of the monastery there so but that was a small segment like even at that time Ben Gavir and Smotrich were like sort of outcast in Israel they weren’t the prominent members of Israeli society and what they represented in those religious zealots of it but now they’re they are in power and they’re dominating everything and you know they say sometimes that if the Israelis didn’t have the Palestinians there’d be a civil war between the secular and the religious Jews which is true that’s what happened do you know there’s enormous tension yeah yeah enormous do you know anyone who’s been spit on any Christians have been spit on me you’ve been spit on horse yeah what do you mean of course that’s disgusting yeah well but that’s the least of it that’s a but that’s the least of it but again I’m saying this as a perspective yeah from the perspective of someone who lives in a majority Christian country that’s paying for all of this right so that’s kind of the that’s them until I’ll tell you a story my father is a priest right in a Greek Orthodox which mean he was wearing a cholera suit he visited one time and we village the town of we visited the town of Taiva and it there was a checkpoint before you enter into the town can you give us perspective where is Taiva is biblical Ephraim it’s when Christ after he raised Lazarus from the dead he went about 10 miles to the northeast of Jerusalem Bethany area to prepare himself before he would come back to Jerusalem for his crucifixion Ephraim is known as the town of compassion of solace even in the time of Saladin they came they actually was called Ephraim it’s now called Taiva which means the good or the beautiful so it was sort of had that reputation so he went there to prepare himself for his crucifixion 20 miles not even 20 miles from from Jerusalem interesting so it’s your father who was my dad yeah a famous an American priest yeah dressed as a priest and my mom was there too so we were going to drive it so there’s a checkpoint sort of at the entrance of the town and then you have many olive groves which by the way I was just telling someone the other day they have about 8 000 acres of land let’s say and over a quarter of it has been confiscated either by settlers and the army allowing them to take their olive groves and there’s they have no recourse there’s nothing who owns the land so Palestinian Christian families and it’s been confiscated from Christian family well confiscate what do you do when they have guns and you don’t I don’t know you you call your patron church in the West and you say raise a stake called Ted Cruz right well and other my described Christian became right and then the only thing the so what did my right right ambassador to Israel he said he was very concerned because at the the also it happened which they didn’t there’s three churches in in Taiba an Orthodox Greek Catholic and Catholic and there’s also the ruins of a 4th century church that Pete that still partially stands and people will still go there sometime not full services but just to be at the spot it’s a place that was built by st

[01:06:31,523]: Helen in the 4th century church of st

[01:06:33,723]: George settlers burned the brush and also there’s a cemetery right next to it burned that area so in the cemetery it everything stone there so nothing burns but they burn the area around there so you have grass and brush that was burned and not only that I was shocked when I saw how much they’ve infiltrated it’s one thing the entrance of town and you’ve taken the open land the olive groves they have been like in that town there’s a beer factory a distillery a hotel and Bedouins are living have been forced off their land around there and are now living at it with allowance of Christians to be there because they have no place else to go and no one to protect them so Ambassador Huckabee comes and he’s in very concerned because an attack on a church and also that same week a Palestinian American had been shot dead by settlers are beaten to death safe was a lot 20 miles not even 12 few a couple miles away and he was going to address that as a Palestinian American to see that it Israel would investigate nobody’s been arrested or does an American citizen yes he’s from Florida he’s often just like I’m American citizen was beaten to death by settlers and no one was arrested no never happens down in Hebron just there and the concern my concern in talking we’re sure that happened we’re absolutely sure that happened yeah and not merely the citizen be beaten to death in an Israeli controlled area paid for by the United States and nobody does anything about it well this is our problem isn’t it I’m sorry I keep stepping on your story so Ambassador Huckabee shows up he shows up and he says you know he’s very concerned about what happened and we’re gonna check it you know but the next day settlers were there with cows marching through the town with their cows so it shows that they and they are in control and not only that just a couple days ago this is a week after he’s been there you know in the Bible there’s a story of Ruth one of the women in Taiba is married to a but she’s a Greek American married they met in school in Boston they got married he was going to business school her husband he came back to Palestine to establish the business she goes with her husband becomes Palestinian come you know gonna care for the people of his nation she was she got a PhD at Harvard she’s written books about the Holy Land and with the the sales of those books little by little she visited parishes in America and she raised money so they could build 30 homes for for Orthodox people so those homes were cars of the people in those homes were burned the other day and there’s graffiti again on the wall and it says it names another village and it says you’re gonna regret this and and the rest I talked to two Israeli people who are from Israel and they couldn’t even decipher the top part so I you know because it’s very interesting a lot of the settlers are actually people from Brooklyn New York yeah they have dual citizenship and and they go back and forth between is freely they can go to Ben Gurion Airport go through Tel Aviv to come to the settlements in the West Bank but those people in Taiba who are American citizens as well they can’t go through Ben Gurion Airport how is it that an American citizen can’t go through Ben Gurion Airport because he’s also a Palestinian are you sure I’m absolutely sure yes they have to go through Jordan and right now then what through a border that is controlled on one side by Israel and right now it’s so difficult they only open for I’ve been told from 8 to 1 or 2 and you’ve got thousands of people trying to come through right so you could be there for hours and you may not get through that day people make plans to you know the only way Palestinians can do anything to be free is to go to another country I mean even for a vacation or something you don’t feel free in your own country I used to feel that when I was living there in the summer times that’s why I would travel to different countries because within Israel and Palestine you feel like you’re in prison you can’t feel like a person and so if you have the opportunity to go away to breathe a little bit you do that since you are an American and you obviously know people in positions of authority when you come back to the US and tell these stories at dinner what do people say at dinner they show concern when you tell the story

[01:11:02,042]: But again maybe it seems too distant for people

[01:11:06,202]: Or I have also you know what since I’ve talked to people in our churches and I’m trying really now to focus on organizing because people say how can we help

[01:11:14,442]: Now they’re really seeing the gross things that are going on

[01:11:18,602]: Where do we send money

[01:11:19,662]: What do we do

[01:11:20,842]: Yes people need money but what we really need is political change

[01:11:23,942]: So I’m sort of bordering on three different congressional districts and we’ve tried to set up appointments with our congressmen

[01:11:31,022]: They’ve thrown us off

[01:11:32,322]: I’m talking about middle aged women trying to go see their congressmen

[01:11:35,222]: They don’t want when you tell them what you want to talk about they don’t want to make an appointment for you to be able to educate them

[01:11:41,022]: I did and then I wrote a letter to my congressman Nicholas Langworthy

[01:11:44,502]: He writes back an Israeli bullet point an AIPAC bullet point reply basically saying you know Hamas is the problem

[01:11:52,322]: And you know it’s okay to send weapons over there

[01:11:55,742]: So but little by little we have to go and keep educating

[01:12:00,362]: If enough people keep knocking on the doors and saying we don’t like what we’re doing why are we sending billions of dollars to Israel

[01:12:08,002]: And then we’re cutting Medicaid we’re cutting people don’t have jobs in his district

[01:12:12,162]: In fact I was listening in and he did a phone town meeting or whatever

[01:12:17,562]: And most of the people were concerned because they didn’t have enough money for groceries or you know what was going to be done with their healthcare in the coming months and years

[01:12:27,342]: And then no questions about he didn’t take my question on the thing

[01:12:31,762]: I wanted to ask about Israel and why we were sending more offensive weapons

[01:12:35,342]: We’re not talking about don’t play this game nothing wrong with the Iron Dome and protecting yourself

[01:12:40,182]: You’re in a tough neighborhood

[01:12:41,342]: I’m talking about assault rifles which was just passed again to give assault rifles that Ben Gavir then just gives into the hands of settlers who then kill the Palestinians in the West Bank

[01:12:54,862]: And we’re financing that

[01:12:56,742]: So some of the people have you not had enough

[01:12:59,562]: You really want this done in your name

[01:13:01,262]: But the politicians make it hard too they don’t want to hear it

[01:13:04,742]: And you have and I understand when I lived there in the early 2000s Congressman Dera Lisa and Carolyn Maloney was still in office at the time

[01:13:14,162]: They were there on an Israeli junket I think it was a 60th anniversary of something but they were willing to come and see me

[01:13:20,082]: But they wouldn’t come to Bethany because that was over the wall or the wall was being built then

[01:13:24,922]: That was in the West Bank

[01:13:26,202]: So we met on the Mount of Olives and they actually came with me and they saw the wall was being constructed then and they saw how people were passing through the rocks

[01:13:34,082]: And they had not good things to say about Israel

[01:13:36,582]: But do you think their vote would have changed

[01:13:39,482]: No

[01:13:40,042]: Not gonna happen

[01:13:41,302]: Not gonna happen

[01:13:42,742]: I once again threw you off track when you were explaining visiting with your parents

[01:13:48,882]: Right

[01:13:49,942]: So we come in we’re heading into Taiba and the soldiers the reason the soldiers are there because just outside of Taiba on one side you have the settlement of Rimonim swimming pools and beautiful homes and the other direction the huge settlement of Ofra

[01:14:06,022]: So these are in the West Bank in areas that’s supposed to be Palestinian

[01:14:09,842]: And so the soldiers there are supposedly protecting them but they block the entrance to Taiba or check who’s going in and out

[01:14:17,542]: And you’re going so they first weren’t gonna let us go

[01:14:20,562]: They said no no no you can’t come through this way

[01:14:22,602]: You gotta go around Ofra go like 20 miles then come back another road to get into Taiba

[01:14:26,742]: I said no no

[01:14:27,622]: They’re only in the country for a couple of weeks

[01:14:29,282]: They’re only here for a few hours

[01:14:30,422]: We’re going in this way

[01:14:31,942]: Finally they let us in

[01:14:33,662]: And then when we go and we said we’re only gonna be a couple hours

[01:14:35,962]: We’re visiting families there and we’ll come back out

[01:14:38,022]: When we come back out the same game

[01:14:41,002]: The soldiers just standing there they play this game to show that they’re in control

[01:14:47,402]: There was no other cars behind us

[01:14:49,402]: They just said no they wouldn’t let us pass

[01:14:51,782]: They’re just gonna wait for a while

[01:14:54,162]: And finally my father temperamental Greek got out of the car and went up to the soldier and said what is this

[01:15:01,222]: I’m an American citizen

[01:15:02,542]: We would just wanna go back to Jerusalem

[01:15:04,422]: And they basically just laughed in his face

[01:15:07,482]: Eventually we were able to move but the scorn they have for Americans is really something else

[01:15:13,802]: They’ve scorned for America

[01:15:14,102]: That’s not the only incident where I’ve seen something like that where they mock America

[01:15:19,982]: Mock America

[01:15:20,762]: America pays for the whole thing

[01:15:22,542]: Well thank you very much

[01:15:25,322]: But there’s no love for America

[01:15:28,462]: Well look I have seen sadly to say during that time American soldiers veterans that would be at the checkpoints and they’d be sort of joking with the soldiers

[01:15:37,862]: So there was probably some camaraderie with certain people who were probably Christian Zionists or of that mentality

[01:15:43,782]: So they were pro Israel

[01:15:45,262]: If you have that view then it’s okay

[01:15:47,882]: But in general no they don’t have any love for Americans

[01:15:52,482]: Really

[01:15:53,142]: Yeah well that was my perception

[01:15:55,262]: I think most Americans would be surprised to learn that

[01:15:58,602]: Yeah it’s about time that it changes

[01:16:01,742]: Why do you think they’re scorned for Americans in a country supported by Israel

[01:16:06,242]: I mean supported by America

[01:16:07,042]: I think that’s just a part of the arrogance of the country

[01:16:09,942]: I think they think they’re due for everything

[01:16:13,542]: There’s not much gratitude

[01:16:16,382]: We’re past that time you know

[01:16:18,382]: Because you’re bringing up something now when I think about it the time period when Joe Biden was a young politician and there was that warm feeling towards Israel and it was sort of the underdog

[01:16:27,462]: But we’re way beyond that time now

[01:16:30,662]: You know so that’s where the sense of before but there might’ve been a sense we’re thankful to America

[01:16:35,162]: But over the years as this whole progression of the greater land of Israel and the dominance of another people and having the power to do it there’s no more of that gratitude

[01:16:48,342]: Have you been attacked for saying things like this

[01:16:52,022]: In which way

[01:16:53,262]: In the United States

[01:16:54,282]: Well like that little slander then

[01:16:56,102]: I mean I’m sure I well we’ll see what happens after this I’m sure

[01:16:59,602]: I actually come to think of it you know we talked before about in the early 2000s my father was a priest at a large church in New York City

[01:17:09,462]: And there was a gathering of a few hundred people and I talked about the situation in Palestine and everybody was receptive

[01:17:16,182]: But then there was a newspaper that I believe was controlled by John Katsimatidis

[01:17:21,302]: He was a big fellow in New York City

[01:17:23,522]: They reported what I said but they also watered it down a lot

[01:17:29,162]: There’s like this idea we don’t wanna go too far and say anything negative about Israel

[01:17:33,802]: And that was back then

[01:17:36,142]: That’s 15 years ago 20 years ago yeah

[01:17:39,122]: So it’s not being attacked necessarily but it’s not letting you be truthful about things

[01:17:43,722]: Do you think Christians in other Arab countries are treated better than Christians in Israel and Palestine

[01:17:51,042]: Well I can only go by times of being there

[01:17:54,882]: In Lebanon too at the time I was there there were churches and they were part of the society

[01:18:01,162]: So there was nothing wrong with being a Christian

[01:18:02,722]: And in Syria when I would now now who knows what’s gonna happen but certainly the time when I was there

[01:18:08,822]: Well Israel controls those countries now

[01:18:10,782]: Well they’re trying to make inroads

[01:18:13,122]: Yeah yeah yeah

[01:18:14,182]: Well what did they do first

[01:18:15,542]: They bombed after Assad went down

[01:18:17,162]: They get rid of all the military

[01:18:19,062]: So what is the point of Abu Jalani being there now

[01:18:22,542]: The ISIS head without who is he serving

[01:18:25,842]: Is he serving the Syrian people or the Israeli people

[01:18:29,022]: What’s the answer

[01:18:31,922]: Right now it looks like he’s serving Israel

[01:18:34,802]: What’s so surprising is that you think of or in the United States people think of Israel as like this foothold of Western civilization in the Middle East

[01:18:43,142]: And so you would imagine the Christians would do a lot better under Israeli control than they would under Assad’s control

[01:18:49,422]: No that’s not the case at all

[01:18:52,722]: That’s definitely not the case at all

[01:18:56,282]: That’s

[01:18:59,982]: I’d like to talk a little bit more about the Palestinians themselves

[01:19:04,102]: I would love to hear it

[01:19:04,502]: And their former resistance because I think one of the reasons I was grateful to be able to come on is to really give a picture of them and the people as they are

[01:19:12,102]: And one thing that’s really struck me I know Muslims I know Bedouins all during this time where they’ve really been suffering what I really get from them is their real belief in God and that their life is in God’s hands

[01:19:25,622]: And there’s such a humility and an obedience to their creator and an understanding that this life is not the only one

[01:19:34,702]: And there’s a real beauty to that that I think so much of the world is missing

[01:19:39,342]: And I think even in sort of there’s a deeper sense to all that’s even going on right now right

[01:19:43,882]: We’re in the heart of Jerusalem the heart of where Christ came

[01:19:47,202]: There was a reason for that

[01:19:49,162]: And now we have a situation where the people who were the closest to God are being destroyed

[01:19:56,682]: In a simple sense I live next to the Mount of Olives

[01:20:01,142]: And when you go down the Mount of Olives it’s where they said Hosanna in the highest here comes Christ

[01:20:06,742]: And often I’ve gone to parish churches in Palestine and the whole community is they know all the service and they’re singing it themselves

[01:20:14,422]: And it reminds me as those people that were on the Mount of Olives greeting the creator greeting the Messiah who is coming for their salvation and honoring him

[01:20:25,522]: And that’s what they’re doing to this day

[01:20:28,042]: And what we’re doing instead is destroying that

[01:20:32,802]: And what does that mean for the world

[01:20:35,302]: When we let that go

[01:20:36,582]: The last time I was there I went through Amman not through Tel Aviv

[01:20:40,582]: So I had to go through the border and then I spent a night

[01:20:43,002]: And in the early morning I was being driven to the airport from Madaba where there’s a mosaic from the sixth century that shows you the places in the Holy land the map in Madaba

[01:20:53,002]: And Madaba is not a very big city

[01:20:55,582]: And as I’m going out of it you very quickly before you get to the airport come to lands that are still being grazed by shepherds

[01:21:03,042]: And I started to weep because to me that’s so emblematic of what the Lord really wanted us to be like in touch with the land recognizing that our life depends on what we grow and what we produce and what we do

[01:21:19,222]: And those kinds of people are the ones who I hear from now who say they’re suffering

[01:21:25,922]: They’re literally gonna be killed but they have so much more courage and faith than you find in so much of America and in the West which we’ve lost

[01:21:38,562]: And to me it’s sort of like this whole war is in a way we’re killing the Christ message

[01:21:46,102]: And that message you can whatever your theology is is one of compassion and tolerance and love

[01:21:53,362]: And the world is becoming smaller in that way

[01:21:56,222]: And I think people sense that right

[01:21:58,622]: How we act to each other and to our neighbor

[01:22:01,902]: There’s so and the very fact that people the politicians and people can listen to doctors listen to what’s going on and still somehow have a blank face and think it’s okay

[01:22:13,162]: How did we come to such a point of darkness

[01:22:16,942]: Well I mean it does seem like part of the broader spiritual war

[01:22:20,562]: Yes absolutely

[01:22:21,922]: I think so

[01:22:22,522]: What happens to the 2 million people who live in Gaza

[01:22:26,722]: Well I can’t say that I’m a Trump fan but I you know he’s a Wheeler dealer

[01:22:31,962]: He wants to get that Nobel peace prize

[01:22:34,682]: He’s got people with a lot of money in Saudi Arabia and Qatar that have his ear

[01:22:39,562]: We don’t have to build a Riviera build it for the Palestinians

[01:22:43,822]: They go and rebuild the area and let it be and reconstruct for a Palestinian nation

[01:22:50,542]: Why is that such an outrageous idea

[01:22:54,062]: Why does Israel think that the people of Palestine have to be their enemy

[01:22:59,622]: They have they say go to Jordan go to Egypt

[01:23:01,882]: What’s the difference another 20 kilometers in

[01:23:05,102]: That’s really what we’re talking about

[01:23:06,862]: The difference between Amman and Tel Aviv is 20 miles at the most to drive between the two

[01:23:13,602]: So what are the difference between the people that live in Palestine that live in Jericho and Bethlehem and someone who lives in Amman

[01:23:19,802]: And what’s the difference between someone who lives in Gaza

[01:23:22,422]: So give them a defined border and have the people of other countries the Arabs too should support the rebuilding of Gaza and have Israel remove their military from there and give and let Gaza have their freedom to be able to develop

[01:23:38,162]: There are some of the most educated people in Gaza

[01:23:41,322]: I mean how many of us have read I hope the stories of Mossad Abu Toha or Rafat who was killed the poet

[01:23:49,502]: Beautiful graceful people

[01:23:51,682]: Bessan Oda now who’s on every day on maybe not everybody sees her not in the mainstream media but these are beautiful young Palestinians who are still trying to live and have joy and see something beautiful in the midst of all their suffering

[01:24:05,662]: So there’s no reason that the money can be there

[01:24:09,042]: And if Trump he’s not a politician he’s a businessman

[01:24:13,222]: Work it out

[01:24:14,302]: I mean it’s I don’t know that that’s gonna happen but our politicians certainly haven’t done it

[01:24:19,442]: What’s the current plan for those people

[01:24:21,422]: It’s probably not to raise a trillion dollars and rebuild the Mamal society

[01:24:25,082]: No but I mean so what is the plan

[01:24:27,442]: Are we in such a world where we can look on live TV that two million people are just slowly gonna die now

[01:24:34,262]: Or are you gonna transfer them

[01:24:37,202]: And why should they be transferred

[01:24:40,962]: Why should they have to leave their land that they’ve been in for centuries

[01:24:44,462]: And in Gaza you know Gaza is as much as the West Bank Gaza the St

[01:24:49,722]: Porphyrius Church from the third century was bombed

[01:24:52,602]: We also have in the Orthodox How did the Christian church get bombed

[01:24:58,642]: Because it’s part of Palestinians

[01:25:01,242]: And all there I’ve been there before

[01:25:04,282]: And basically it’s the Holy Family Church and the Baptist Church they’re all pretty much in the same area

[01:25:10,022]: So you can’t make a mistake

[01:25:12,722]: And Christians through But you don’t think that was an accident

[01:25:16,102]: No no nothing’s an accident

[01:25:18,322]: I mean occasionally a shell might go off but no

[01:25:20,662]: And certainly the last time with the one where they pointed at the cross

[01:25:24,982]: You don’t miss that

[01:25:26,302]: Explain that

[01:25:26,742]: Well the Holy Family Church the cross didn’t topple but literally inches from it

[01:25:32,322]: And I have you know in Nablus at Jacob’s well there’s a large church now and there’s crosses on the front face in circles

[01:25:41,922]: And the monk always points out to us when I go there there’s a tank shell that was pointed that was aimed at that cross

[01:25:48,222]: You can still see it from an earlier confrontation in Nablus

[01:25:51,882]: So don’t tell me these soldiers make mistakes

[01:25:54,902]: You could the church in Gaza as you know it’s pointed and the cross is there in the middle of it by itself

[01:26:03,302]: So it’s hard to believe that it wasn’t a person

[01:26:06,542]: So what would you say to Ted Cruz the self proclaimed Christian supporting tank shells fired at crosses

[01:26:13,662]: Like what is that

[01:26:15,182]: Well I would say you know again it’s to disabuse of the notion

[01:26:18,302]: It’s those same talking points that the congressmen gave

[01:26:21,562]: Well but Hamas is the problem and they’re terrorists

[01:26:23,762]: Well Hamas is not the problem

[01:26:26,192]: So don’t use that as an excuse anymore

[01:26:29,482]: And we have to defend Christian values American values and dignity freedom for people

[01:26:37,002]: Isn’t that what we’re all about

[01:26:39,502]: Having their rights

[01:26:44,382]: What happens on the Temple Mount

[01:26:47,502]: What is the Temple Mount

[01:26:48,842]: Can you explain what that is

[01:26:49,862]: Well the Temple Mount is the area where the temple existed at the time of Christ

[01:26:55,222]: In Jerusalem right

[01:26:57,402]: Directly I lived in the convent of St

[01:26:59,602]: Mary Magdalene on the Mount of Olives

[01:27:01,902]: Directly in front of me is the Dome of the Rock and there’s the old walls the walls of the old city

[01:27:08,442]: And within that is the area where the temple had been existed right

[01:27:13,702]: There was also a Byzantine church at one point in the fifth century because where the Dome of the Rock is is where Abraham sacrificed or was going to sacrifice his son Isaac

[01:27:23,342]: So it’s holy to all monotheistic traditions

[01:27:26,422]: And so on the left side if you’re looking from the convent where I was at is the Wailing Wall

[01:27:31,522]: That’s a portion of the temple that still exists a wall

[01:27:34,542]: And so some just like the Christian Zionists the Jews want the temple rebuilt

[01:27:41,702]: So I know Christians who have been there who will take a sign and go take the crescent off the dome and say we’ll put a cross on there

[01:27:50,342]: It’s natural to all of them to do

[01:27:52,062]: So there is this movement to rebuild the temple

[01:27:55,402]: All the time I was there I heard about that but and there were a small movement of it

[01:28:01,102]: But there’s a mosque where the temple was

[01:28:02,882]: Yeah now it’s Al Asqa Mosque

[01:28:04,142]: It’s the third holiest site for Muslims in the world

[01:28:06,801]: And a lot of confrontations you have is because Israel will control getting in and out being able to go there

[01:28:15,502]: So or they’ll say only men over 50 can go to the mosque today

[01:28:19,782]: And there’s a lot of confrontations there and people have been killed

[01:28:23,362]: So it is a mosque

[01:28:24,222]: Yeah there’s a functioning Al Asqa Mosque is there

[01:28:28,522]: So you can’t build the temple with the mosque there

[01:28:30,301]: No

[01:28:30,822]: And they say that they have the plans for rebuilding the temple and everything

[01:28:34,362]: And people like Ben Gavir the minister who’s a religious zealot have gone on the Temple Mount

[01:28:40,722]: And it’s a provocation

[01:28:42,282]: The area is controlled by religiously by Jordan

[01:28:46,862]: But there’s an organization that’s responsible for that area

[01:28:51,982]: Okay so you hear people say we’re gonna rebuild the temple the third temple

[01:28:55,222]: But there’s a mosque there

[01:28:56,782]: So what’s the plan for the mosque

[01:28:58,502]: Well I guess it would be to blow it up

[01:29:01,441]: What would and then you just said that’s the third holiest site in Islam

[01:29:04,242]: Of Islam of course

[01:29:05,301]: This would be a dark day for anybody

[01:29:07,622]: So then what would happen if you blew up the third holiest site in Islam

[01:29:11,482]: Well you could probably answer that better than me

[01:29:14,402]: It certainly would ignite a great conflict in the world

[01:29:18,822]: I just wanna say this out loud because people sort of blithely talk about it

[01:29:23,362]: Oh what we’re really coming to

[01:29:25,342]: And I think that’s the problem with the Christian Zionist is that what is your end game here

[01:29:32,822]: Their belief tells them that’s okay

[01:29:35,122]: We want to have this third world war because we’re gonna be taken away

[01:29:39,441]: And we’ll be okay

[01:29:40,702]: And we’ll come back later after all the fighting’s done

[01:29:43,322]: That’s sort of basically what their theology tells them

[01:29:46,441]: And in the meantime all the Jews are supposed to convert to their brand of Christianity or die in the conflagration

[01:29:54,342]: And so I’m asking you this because you’re a nun

[01:29:58,122]: That’s not a Christian that’s not a It’s not a Christian belief no

[01:30:02,162]: Or precepts yeah

[01:30:04,502]: Any idea where that came from that idea

[01:30:07,142]: The rapture

[01:30:08,222]: Yeah

[01:30:08,742]: Well like I said originally the idea of having the thousand year kingdom is a heresy that was in the early church

[01:30:15,242]: But the real push of all that becomes from the 1830s

[01:30:18,482]: James Darby Schofield or John Darby Schofield

[01:30:21,502]: It’s sort of so it’s a new theology that has no basis in the foundations of Christianity

[01:30:27,022]: And it has nothing to do with it

[01:30:29,662]: How do you think this story ends

[01:30:32,262]: It depends on us

[01:30:34,882]: And that’s why you know maybe I part of me wants to have that message of that we have to do something politically

[01:30:41,742]: The Christians have to wake up until they’re because it’s all in the hands of the United States

[01:30:46,762]: It doesn’t matter what any of the country in the world does

[01:30:49,022]: If US protects Israel this will continue

[01:30:51,422]: And we will get to that conclusion of the denouement which will lead to a third world war or something of that sort for sure

[01:31:00,681]: So but also in a spiritual sense then we also have to recognize what do we want to be as people

[01:31:06,202]: Do we want to follow the way of Christ

[01:31:09,181]: Or do we want to follow the way of a Christ who leads us to a better world

[01:31:14,622]: We live in this world as best we can in order to prepare for the world to come

[01:31:20,042]: Not we don’t look Christ came and said my kingdom is not of this world

[01:31:23,882]: So if you’re truly a believing Christian you want to do all the things that will put you in good graces with God when it comes to judgment day right

[01:31:34,922]: And that doesn’t mean rebuilding the temple

[01:31:37,681]: It means living like a Christian and trying to build a society that lives by Christian principles and your government acting as one that acts by Christian principles

[01:31:46,762]: And so that doesn’t mean slaughtering other people and leading to their cleansing

[01:31:53,482]: I really appreciate you taking this time

[01:31:57,301]: I think that I appreciate you

[01:31:59,342]: I hope it does a little bit to open people’s eyes

[01:32:02,322]: And I just want to end with one thing

[01:32:04,061]: Of course

[01:32:04,742]: I think the only way you know there was the writer Ta Nehisi Coates who you may have differences opinion on other things but what really opened his eyes he went with a writer’s group to the West Bank and went and saw how the Palestinians were living and what the reality of the occupation was

[01:32:20,542]: And that got him to understand we have to make some changes

[01:32:23,482]: And there have been changes in the black church communities definitely reaching out

[01:32:28,642]: I would like one I think that we have to have many more people come and see and not go on an AIPAC junket but really go

[01:32:35,561]: And as Christians tell your communities we want to go and we want to go and visit our Palestinian Christian communities

[01:32:41,922]: And this might be a little you could decide what you want to do with it

[01:32:45,522]: My dream thing would be to have a trip perhaps have you come on the trip perhaps have Mel Gibson Cat Stevens

[01:32:54,822]: It’s a funny side of thing but he’s a guy who was born in the Greek church and is now a Muslim

[01:33:01,002]: And Zoran and Brad Lander and try to give the idea and Marjorie Taylor Greene

[01:33:07,602]: The point is we have to expose what’s going on

[01:33:10,462]: I want to go to that dinner

[01:33:11,202]: All right not just a dinner

[01:33:12,702]: You’re going to come visit with my friends in Jenin okay

[01:33:16,822]: And in Bethlehem

[01:33:18,202]: And then you’re going to go tell the world what’s going on there

[01:33:21,322]: Because you’re all much better communicators than I am

[01:33:24,022]: And the world really has aren’t we horrified by the idea

[01:33:27,702]: Aren’t you as a media person horrified

[01:33:29,742]: Why can’t reporters go into Gaza

[01:33:33,902]: Why can’t and reporters are not allowed in large portions of the West Bank now

[01:33:38,122]: They call them military zones

[01:33:40,142]: What kind of press freedom is that

[01:33:42,002]: And what are they trying to hide

[01:33:43,681]: So the only way that’s going to break that is by enough of us saying enough influencers going over there and saying I want to see what’s going on and then report back

[01:33:54,382]: And I thank you for giving me at least this little opportunity

[01:33:59,322]: Hope moves things in the right direction

[01:34:01,662]: Thank you

[01:34:02,242]: All right thank you

[01:34:03,061]: Very much

[01:34:03,742]: Okay

[01:34:08,122]: So it turns out that YouTube is suppressing this show

[01:34:11,882]: On one level that’s not surprising

[01:34:13,522]: That’s what they do

[01:34:14,142]: But on another level it’s shocking

[01:34:15,902]: With everything that’s going on in the world right now all the change taking place in our economy and our politics with the wars on the cusp of fighting right now Google has decided you should have less information rather than more

[01:34:28,422]: And that is totally wrong

[01:34:30,522]: It’s immoral

[01:34:32,102]: What can you do about it

[01:34:33,722]: Well we could whine about it

[01:34:35,102]: That’s a waste of time

[01:34:36,322]: We’re not in charge of Google

[01:34:37,282]: Or we could find a way around it a way that you could actually get information that is true not intentionally deceptive

[01:34:43,422]: The way to do that on YouTube we think it’s to subscribe to our channel

[01:34:47,301]: Subscribe

[01:34:47,922]: Hit the little bell icon to be notified when we upload and share this video

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